This page contains all the messages put onto the BSN Stereo Chat Board during January, 1998. They are in chronological order from first to last. To search for specific topics, use the "find" utility on your browser. For a search of the complete archives, please go to the Stereo Chat Board Archives Main Page.
|
Name: Charles G. Hill Website: Chez Chaz From: Dustbury, Oklahoma Time: 1998-01-01 09:40:00 Comments: If I'm reading Mike correctly, he doesn't give out Fs except for utter failure or apparent fraud - anything with any smidgen of conceivable value will get at least the lowest of low Ds. The Best of 60s Party Rock" (Priority CDL-7921, now apparenly out of print) doesn't even make a good coaster - except that it contains the stereo "Land of 1000 Dances" by Cannibal and the Headhunters. The other thirteen tracks you already have (except maybe for the rerecording of "Louie Louie"), and they almost certainly sound better than they do here, Priority in those days being located in the same Hollywood hotbox as Original Sound and using Dr. Waring's same damn-the-sound-kill-the-hiss technique. Mike gives it a D. And to Paul Bigelow, with regret: "Why do you think they call it monotheism?" [ -- Groan. -- MC] |
|
Name: Barry From: North Carolina Time: 1998-01-01 18:11:00 Comments: In response to Tom Daly's question concerning Vanilla Fudge's "You Keep Me Hangin' On", the liner notes for the Rhino CD Psychedelic Sundae: The Best of Vanilla Fudge state that the song was recorded in mono as a demo, and the demo was used as the master. So I guess we will have to settle for the mono in this case. |
|
Name: Cary E.
Mansfield From: Varese Sarabande Records Time: 1998-01-01 19:48:00 Comments: In response to Tom Daly, I'm sorry you were disapointed with our On The Radio series CDs. The tape for the single version of Steppenwolf's "Magic Carpet Ride" no longer exists, so we had to master it from a mint vinyl single. The Reflections was mastered from the original tape source and was never available in stereo before. I think Bill Inglot did an incredible job with this track. "Susan" by the Buckinghams was edited exactly like the original Columbia promo single. Pat Downey provided us with a copy of the record and was a big help with this project. Dick and I worked over a year on this project and we are very proud of the end result. Thanks for your comments. |
|
Name: John
Adkins From: Phoenix Time: 1998-01-02 15:06:00 Comments: I just stumbled on Dick Bartley's website construction by hit and miss, i.e., "Well, I wonder if there's anything at www.dickbartley.com?" and voila!... For Cary Mansfield--thanks for confirming my suspicion that "Magic Carpet Ride" on the On The Radio series was mastered from a 45... I thought I heard some surface noise on the track. Which leads me to ask, is "Sky Pilot" also from a 45? Again, I seem to detect a bit of surface noise. And what about the Mamas & Papas track--while I don't recall surface noise, it "sounds" like a 45. Kind of grungy, everything narrowly in the middle, unlike most mono CD tracks that seem to be wider. Mono, of course, but sounding wider, especially with headphones. I don't have any complaints about the Reflections track; it's the real nugget on this CD series--it sounds good to me and I'm one who cranks up the high end on my system. Re: "Spinning Wheel," I suppose it's nice to have it along with the full version on the recent BS&T 2-CD anthology, but I just hate this particular 45 edit, especially the added guitar break! Back in early '69 the LP version of this and other songs on the album were in "power rotation" on the Top 40 station I favored in Tucson (KIKX, home of, at that time, Shadoe Stevens, before he was Shadoe Stevens). [ -- Hmmmm. Mono wider? That's something that doesn't compute. -- MC] |
|
Name: Mike Hartman From: Vernon Hills, IL Time: 1998-01-03 13:34:00 Comments: "Listen People" by Hermans Hermits in STEREO. I've got it. The bad news is that it's the movie version from When The Boys Meets The Girls. It was recorded in July of 1965. We'll it at least gives us an idea what the hit version would sound like in stereo. It's from a new CD from Turner Classic Movies and Rhino called: Hollywood's Best: The Sixties. Although the cover says that all but two tracks are stereo, they missed one other from the Animals ("Around & Around"). The Sham the Sham cut also is mono, as listed ("Monkey See, Monkey Do"). Also on this CD is the movie version, in great stereo, of "The Girl From Ipanema" by Astrud Gilberto & Stan Getz (from Get Yourself A College Girl). |
|
Name: Jay Fink From: Albany, NY Time: 1998-01-03 15:57:04 Comments: Happy New Year Mike and Brenda, and all the BSN Chat regulars. I work in one stop business and have been getting several requests for the oldies label Relic, which, if I recall from the newsletter, had Little Walter behind the board for a few productions. Are they still in business? And if not, are there plans for the label to reemerge under a different imprint? Thanks in advance. [ -- As far as I know, they're still in business, although I haven't seen much in the way of product lately. -- MC] |
|
Name: Paul From: Florida Time: 1998-01-03 19:17:10 Comments: Does anyone know what tracks are mono on the Curb CD Gold Vault of Hits, Vol 1 by the Four Seasons? I'm trying to find stereo versions to replace the mono versions I already have on the Rhino CD Anthology by the Four Seasons. Any help appreciated; I hate to spend $15 and get the same mono tracks.... [ -- BSN Newsletter subscribers already know the answer to this question, of course, since it was reviewed in issue #45, page 593. :-) The mono tracks are: "Let's Hang On," "Dawn (Go Away)," "Girl Come Running," and "Ronnie." -- MC] |
|
Name: Joel Goldenberg From: Montreal Time: 1998-01-04 17:00:22 Comments: Silly me! Didn't realize I had beautiful, wide stereo versions of Dawn's "Candida" and "Knock Three Times" right under my nose. For those who still own vinyl, they're both on K-Tel's three-record set Today's Super Greats, from '73. Wonder why Bell and Arista were so inconsistent with these two tracks? By the way, the same K-tel record has Shocking Blue's "Venus" and Brian Hyland's "Gypsy Woman" in fake stereo. Wonder if anyone else knows of such anomalies on K-Tel or other labels. |
|
Name: David Clark From: Ottawa Time: 1998-01-04 20:59:04 Comments: Hi everyone! I just receive via mail order the two new Dick Bartley CDs on Varese Vintage, and am I impressed! I really appreciate the efforts of all involved to bring these alternate 45 versions to us collectors. Also, hearing the stereo on “(Just Like) Romeo and Juliet “ is fantastic! A big thanks goes out. Of note, “No Sugar Tonight” is indicated as first time on CD, but not so! I managed to find the 45 edit on 18 Screamers From The 70's, a JCI/Warner Special Products release from 1995. Also, “Timothy” has the same lyrics as on the Have A Nice Day, Vol. 6 – is the modified version anywhere? A suggestion for a future release: the 45 version of Mamas and Papas' “Creeque Alley” – this contains overdubs and a “fixed” vocal at the end of the song, both not found in the stereo mix. Keep it coming with more!! Also, to my knowledge, a first time stereo on CD (for me, first time, period) for Jackie Lee’s “The Duck” on The 30 Top Teen Dances on Black Tulip. |
|
Name: Christopher
Nagel Time: 1998-01-05 23:05:17 Comments: For Paul Bigelow: The soundtrack LP for Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer was originally released on Decca Records in mono and stereo in 1964. It was issued again in the early 1970s with a huge "Simulated Stereo" sticker plastered to the cover (I bought this new, my first copy). Later, sometime in the late '70s, MCA re-issued it with a cut-and-paste cover (no stereo mentioned, I have this version, too). The MCA CD has the same versions as these LPs (however, it has better sound).... Also, I have a question: can anyone (or Mike??) tell me where I can purchase the "Lost in the 50s/60s" CEMA CDs? Hopefully at a mass marketer/chain store/music store. I've tried several cyber-stores, but to no avail. [ -- I thought they were available since last summer, and I know I've seen them in stores, but apparently they seem to have been held up until January 1, 1998 for some reason. I assume you'll be able to find them now in cyberstores and chains like Tower. -- MC] |
|
Name: Paul
Stoddard From: Boston, MA Time: 1998-01-06 12:26:44 Comments: I'm looking at the February release sheet for Atlantic Records' upcoming set of various artists packages. There are 4 of them, entitled Ultimate '50's R&B Smashes, Ultimate '60's Soul Sensations, Ultimate '60's Soul Smashes, and Ultimate '70's R&B Smashes. The sales hype says: "Celebrate Atlantic's 50th anniversary with a motherlode of golden hits, yours at amazing prices." These are all in the Super Value series, carrying a $9.98 list price and containing 14 tracks each. I don't see the Rhino logo anywhere on that particular page, but I'd be willing to bet that we're about to be served up more mono.... In the same release are Atlantic 50th Anniversary collections from Big Joe Turner, Percy Sledge, Ben E. King, The Clovers, and Solomon Burke. These pages have the Rhino logo all over them, so you can bet that these will be more mono. Of course, nowhere on any of the pages is there any statement about mono or stereo content.... Rhino and Atlantic: If you're reading, then you should know that you've lost sales on these items to most of the readers of this group. In fact, the whole Rhino label is on very thin ice with collectors, period. Enough with the mono, already. You've put this stuff out in mono at least three times in various packages since you started mishandling the catalog. Give up the mono fetish and bring on the stereo. |
|
Name: Tom
Daly Website: Skyline From: Malden, MA Time: 1998-01-06 17:10:58 Comments: Re: David Clark's comments about the Black Tulip package... I've recently obtained several Black Tulip releases and am impressed with all. The Santo & Johnny package had some distortion, but it was obvious that the distortion was in the master tape; an amateur engineer wasn't quite watching his VU meters! Anyway, my rule of thumb today is that if it's on Black Tulip, it's probably well-mastered (Now, why do I suspect "Little Walter" DeVenne to be involved with these?). They're great... stereo when stereo exists and mono when it doesn't. No phony stereo here! |
|
Name: Marty
Natchez Time: 1998-01-07 01:06:34 Comments: Although it's nice to hear the original mono mixes of many Four Seasons hits on Ace Records' reissue CD of the group's Edition D'Oro double LP (minus three tracks), it does not contain the authentic 45 mix of "Sherry." On my mono copy of Vee Jay's "Golden Hits of the Four Seasons" (VJLP 1065), the original mix has added reverb on the line "I'm gonna make-a you my-yi-yi-yine" and the song contains a longer fadeout. I'm sure this was also the true single master, issued on Vee Jay 456. The Ace track, however, lacks any such enhancement, plus its shortened ending is the same as on the common stereo version. Also know that any stereo Vee Jay pressing of a Four Seasons album that included "Sherry" reportedly offers an alternate mix of the song that splits Frankie Valli's lead vocal on both left and right channels. After the group left the label, Philips never used this unique mix, nor has it reappeared elsewhere. |
|
Name: Paul
Bigelow From: Austin, TX Time: 1998-01-07 10:16:44 Comments: I think the Rhino "original mono, CRANK IT!" kick started with the acquisition of Rhino by WEA. When Rhino was independent or with the old CEMA, Rhino did remixing and was careful (usually) to state so. Rhino's hands may be tied with WEA because of the condition of Atlantic's catalog. I have never heard anything approaching a definitive answer as to the physical quality of the remaining tapes after the Atlantic vault fire. All the artists questioned: Otis, Aretha, Rascals, Ray Charles, Wilson Pickett, Burke, Darin, Coasters, Drifters, etc. fall under Atlantic. Most of those artists have had BEAUTIFULLY packaged Rhino retrospectives but the stereo content has been haphazard or non-existant. If the tapes are truly not available (as opposed to uncataloged) then the situation will not change. I guess after a fire things get messy, water damage, disarray. I suppose for business reasons, Atlantic/Rhino would have little to gain by coming clean and state that "NO STEREO MIXES WILL EVER BE FORTHCOMING DUE TO THE VAULT FIRE. EVERTHING WAS LOST". That would be cutting off your customers before giving a throughly RESEARCHED package a chance to succeed. On the other hand, water damage can be corrected to some extent and if it's a matter of an unorganized tape vault then that needs to be rectified. [ -- From what I've heard, the fire only destroyed the non-released tapes like multitracks and unissued product; the masters for all previously issued LPs and 45s, including all stereo LPs issued previously, were apparently not touched as they were stored elsewhere. The fire occurred about 20 years ago, so any mess should be cleaned up by now. I really don't think that the fire is the problem with Atlantic. The A&R people at Atlantic really do think mono sounds better, apparently, and have pretty much convinced Rhino's staff of that. I'll have to give this much to them: they haven't done a thing to improve the sound of the stereo tapes, since they all seem to sound like hiss-monsters, so the 45 tapes don't usually have so much hiss. On the other hand, they tend to be loaded with other types of tape grunge. I suppose that I'll be making some people mad with this statement, but it just doesn't seem like anybody there cares about the sound quality anymore. Get the stuff out (in mono) as quickly as possible, spend some time on packaging to make the product look pretty, and your job is done. Sounds like they've been studying oldies reissue production at the Gregg Geller School for the Sonically Indifferent. -- MC] |
|
Name: Paul
Bigelow From: Austin, TX Time: 1998-01-07 14:53:06 Comments: To continue the Atlantic/Rhino mono thread... What makes the whole matter even more infuriating is that something (undetermined what) MAY have survived. The Crosby, Stills, and Nash Box has unissued tracks and I remember an article that stated that the Sonny and Cher hits collection (Atco 91796-2) was remixed from multi- tracks into mostly MONO! Perhaps the artists had possession of session tapes in these cases. It would be nice to know what we could possibly expect. |
|
Name: John Sellards Website: VanMeter Recordings From: Beckley, WV Time: 1998-01-07 17:03:57 Comments: Mike, I think that using the mono is not always a bad decision, but I do have a problem with sloppily mastered mono. How many CDs have you auditioned that have mono that is out of phase or is obviously mastered using both channels (i.e., a full track tape played back on a stereo machine) that actually makes the droputs and such seem worse??? Someone is making the decision to use the mono, but bad mastering is just laziness. |
|
Name: John
Adkins From: Phoenix Time: 1998-01-07 20:03:32 Comments: Mono is bad. Stereo is good. Well, that may be an oversimplification, but it's generally how I feel. However, there have been so many inferior stereo mixes released that a clean, bright, hard mono mix may be a good alternative. That's the operative word--alternative. (As has been discussed before in BSN...) Labels, why not give us both versions on the CD, especially of the hits. I will admit to rather liking the good mono mix of "The Letter" (Box Tops) on Bartley's new CD. The stereo mix on the Arista anthology from last year is still weak at the beginning--my feeling about this probably also stems from oldies stations repeatedly missing the first beat (or two) of the song when they either start it too soon under the jingle or just don't pot it up loud enough. "This Diamond Ring" (Gary Lewis) is another example of a song being upcut the same way. Now in regard to primo stereo mixes, I too just love that newly-unearthed hot stereo "Shotgun" (Jr. Walker) on the Dancing/Nick at Nite Club CD. |
|
Name: Hugh Wagner Time: 1998-01-08 03:51:07 Comments: Back in 1994, I wrote a complaint letter to Rhino about their use of mono vs stereo in most of their latest reissues and did receive a letter back from them. They said that in their opinion, mono sounds better, more "there" and that was that. If the customers wanted stereo, they could go buy an old stereo record. Mike published that letter in issue #31 of Both Sides Now. Since that time, I have purchased about five CDs from them, mostly mono-available-only stuff. |
|
Name: Charles G. Hill Website: Chez Chaz From: Dustbury, Oklahoma Time: 1998-01-09 11:23:07 Comments: For Christopher Nagel: Rhino Direct (the mail-order division) is offering the three EMI Lost Hits discs as a set through their catalog - R2 91297, $32.98. I don't know if you can get these through their Web site or not, but the phone guys will happily serve 'em up for you. |
|
Name: Marty
Natchez Time: 1998-01-09 18:31:34 Comments: Mourning the loss of Sonny Bono reminded me how much I liked Sonny and Cher's 1966 single "Have I Stayed Too Long" (ATCO 6420). I didn't buy any of the duo's albums back then, so I'm curious to learn if it was ever released in stereo. The song is found on Rhino's 1991 CD The Best of Sonny and Cher: The Beat Goes On in mono. Any help? |
|
Name: Linda T. From: Rome,N.Y. Time: 1998-01-10 12:03:33 Comments: Reminicing about Sonny & Cher ...... Back in 1966 when I was a senior in high school, a friend lent me a Sonny & Cher album (I'm not sure which one). On the back was a poem written for them (author?). It has always stayed in my memory because it reflects the times so well. Enjoy!!! Look At You, Look At Me Look at you, look at me, walking ten feet tall are we, Smiling silly smiles all day, how'd we ever get that way? Look at them, look at us, wonderin' why we make such fuss. Staring like we're not all there, like looney birds are everywhere. Can't they tell it? Can't they see? What's so special 'bout you and me? Poor old world can't recognize, that's love light shining in our eyes. Well, look at us and look again, and maybe you'll remember when, you walked this tall and knew it too, and the whole world turned to look at you! Hope you enjoyed it! LINDA T. |
|
Name: Curt
Lundgren Time: 1998-01-10 12:05:38 Comments: I know this forum is dedicated to exploring true stereo in a Top 40 sense, but I feel I must pass along an interesting find outside that arena. I'm always fascinated by Hollywood's early multi-track recording, and have stumbled upon an interesting release in the 20th Century Fox "Classic Soundtrack" series: The Day The Earth Stood Still. For starters, one of the few thoughtful SF movies of the 50s, with a score by Bernard Herrmann, and conducting by Herrman and both Lionel and Alfred Newman. But the soundtrack is in True Stereo, as recorded in 1951!. Now I know multi-track recording goes back even further in Hollywood, but the question here is, WHY was this ST recorded that way? After all....in the 50s, theatres were hardly set up for binaural sound, and certainly those that were (Cinerama?) featured bigger, more broad-based pictures.... not sci-fi material. Any comment/input from cinema buffs? (BTW: CD is 20th 11010-2, distributed by BMG/Arista) |
|
Name: Chuck & Patty Wagon From: Toledo, Ohio Time: 1998-01-10 20:22:19 Comments: The Lost Hits Of The 50's, 60's, 70's & 80's from EMI-Capitol Special Markets are available from CDMO. To order call 1-800-FOR-CDMO (1-800-367-2366) or 516-242-8820, or order over the web at WWW.CDMO.COM. [ -- Thanks for the info. Chuck and Patty Wagon? A likely story. -- MC] |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-10 21:34:52 Comments: Re: hiss, mono, Atlantic, etc... Just about all of Cream's material recorded in the US at Atlantic just has tons and tons of hiss. And I always thought Tom Dowd was suppossed to know what he was doing.... The recent box set does not really help the sound at all - I don't know if any type of hiss reduction technology would work or not, but I think it would be worth a shot.... Also, I still feel the whole fire story is somewhat of an excuse - SOME tapes have to be out there somewhere, either the multitracks or copies of them. I just don't believe that all of the multitracks were there and all of them got ruined in the fire.... |
|
Name: Paul
Stoddard From: Boston, MA Time: 1998-01-12 16:08:04 Comments: While paging through the latest Rhino catalog, I noticed that only volumes 5-9 of the British Invasion series are still listed. Volumes 1-4 have been deleted. All of these volumes rated an "A" in the BSN book. If you are interested in them and haven't gotten around to purchasing copies, you might want to pick them up before they disappear completely. I'm guessing that the reason they were deleted is that they were manufactured by Capitol, and that Rhino's license has expired. |
|
Name: Jim Nasium From: Toledo, Ohio Time: 1998-01-15 20:26:27 Comments: There is a wonderful interview (in Real Audio) with Sonny Bono done about 9 years ago, where he talks extensively about Phil Spector and his early recording days, at www.bobshannon.com ... check it out! |
|
Name: Joel
Goldenberg From: Montreal Time: 1998-01-16 12:43:33 Comments: Regarding Atlantuic mono and stereo, stereo versions have usually been preferable. However, early Stax/Volt stereo (Otis Blue, Otis Redding's The Soul Album) was horrific, despite Tom Dowd's engineering abilities. Most Stax songs from 1965-66 should remain mono. Speaking of Atlantic, why can't a stereo version of Ben E. King's "I (Who Have Nothing)" be found? Does it exist? [ -- One of the Ben E. King CDs mentioned that the magnificent music track to that song was actually a purchased instrumental track from Italy, and that Ben E. King just came into the studio one day and put words down. If the track was mono, that would mean we'd hear King on one track and all the rest on the other. Even as much of a stereo nut as I am, I'm not sure I'd be ready to spoil the sound of that song in that way, since it would sound very different for sure. -- MC] |
|
Name: G
Cassan Time: 1998-01-16 20:32:51 Comments: For all you Rolling Stones fan out there, please be advised that the Japanese CDs are still available. Costly to order, but well worth buying to get stereo versions of some of the old songs and/or alternate versions of some others. Check the FAQ on the website for the Rolling Stones, namely under stereo content. I've contributed some comments to this article based on the Japanese CDs I've collected over the past 2 years. Yes, the Hot Rocks and More Hot Rocks Japanese versions are quite different for the above mentioned reasons.... Question for Mike Callahan. When can we expect a new version of Both Sides Now book? [ -- The Third Edition of Oldies on CD will be out in 1998. -- MC] |
|
Name: Bob Olivia From: Burbank. California Time: 1998-01-16 23:10:19 Comments: Stereo Masters do exist for all Atco/Atantic Artists from the Coasters, Bobby Darin, Sonny & Cher, Drifters, LaVerne Baker, etc. We know it, Atlantic and Rhino know it, but only we care. Rhino puts out, for instance, "Poison Ivy" on their 1959 ripoff Greatest Hits with only 10 songs, in Stereo, but still say they don't have masters. Who's kidding whom???. |
|
Name: T. Ruth Teller From: Lost In Cyberspace Time: 1998-01-17 09:50:22 Comments: What a load of rubbish that Rhino/Atlantic is trying to sell. The problem is not lost masters, but wrongheaded corporate thinking, or listening for that matter. People like Joe Sasfy, Bob Hyde and Little Walter Devenne have been able to find previously unissued stereo masters, like "Bumble Bee" by Lavern Baker and "Zing Went The Strings Of My Heart" by the Coasters, to name a few. Of course, they're out on labels OTHER than Rhino/Atlantic. The UK Sequel reissues of the original Coasters Atco LP's (with mucho bonus tracks) have some previously unissued stereo, notably "The Shadow Knows" on Greatest Hits (also the stereo "Zing..." and "Three Cool Cats" among others). Coast Along with the Coasters has the same stereo content as the original 1962 stereo LP, and a stereo alternate of "I'm A Hog For You", continuing a long tradition of Coasters' stereo differing from the mono. |
|
Name: G
Cassan Time: 1998-01-18 10:03:54 Comments: Have there been any CD releases of the Baja Marimba Band as yet?? |
|
Name: Paul
Stoddard From: Boston, MA Time: 1998-01-18 11:57:32 Comments: First, a followup to a previous message regarding the availability of the Japanese Hot Rocks CDs by the Rolling Stones: please be aware that the American versions of Hot Rocks were released in December in Japan. They are 2-CD sets and have the catalog numbers POCD-1973/4 (Hot Rocks 1, Volumes 1 and 2) and POCD-1975/6 (Hot Rocks 2, Volumes 1 and 2). The original STEREO Hot Rocks are 4 single CDs that have the numbers POCD-1927 (Hot Rocks 1), POCD-1928 (Hot Rocks 2), POCD-1929 (More Hot Rocks 1), and POCD-1930 (More Hot Rocks 2). So, make sure you know what you're getting.... Second: does anyone know what the corporate relationship between Rhino and WEA is? When Rhino was affiliated with Capitol, it was a licensing and distribution deal only, with Rhino operating autonomously. I get the sneaking suspicion that the ties and control are a lot tighter in the WEA arrangement.... Third: DCC is having its annual direct-to-customers sale until February 15. All DCC titles, including the gold discs are marked down an average of $3.00 per CD. There is an added bonus in that if you buy 5 or more of the gold discs or 180+ vinyl LPs, the cost is reduced to $20.00 per item. Call 800-301-6874 to order. The new Elvis Presley, Roy Orbison, and Jethro Tull gold discs are fantastic! |
|
Name: Joel
Goldenberg From: Montreal Time: 1998-01-18 15:36:26 Comments: Here's something that will probably never be on CD, at least in North America: The "stereo" versions" of Otis Redding's pre-Otis Blue material. These tracks were overdubed with extra instruments and were featured on the Best of Otis Redding 2-LP set back in '72. In my opinion, these were the best, most non-obtrusive overdubs of old material ever done. Does anyone know if Booker T and the MGs overdubbed more of the 1962-65 tracks?... On another subject, Mike, have you ever thought of compiling the Both Sides Now interviews and non-review material into a new book? I'd buy it! [ -- It's a thought, but I'm booked up with the 3rd edition of Oldies on CD first. -- MC] |
|
Name: John
Mahoney Time: 1998-01-18 18:23:05 Comments: Hi Mike & Brenda, Could you tell us whether any of the stereo singles you mention on page 5 of BSN Newsletter were issued with mono counterparts or is the very nature of a stereo single exclusive of mono issues? If there are separate issues, are there matrix distinctions? To refresh your memory the singles cited are: "To A Solider Boy" - The Tassels/"Lavender Blue" - Sammy Turner/"40 Miles Of Bad Road" - Duane Eddy/"Among My Souvenirs" - Connie Francis/"Gazachstahagen - The Wildcats/"I've Got To Change" b/w "It Hurts To Tell You" - James Brown & The Famous Flames/"Don't Let It Happen To Me" b/w "Good Good Lovin" - James Brown & The Famous Flames/"Three Stars" - Ruby Wright/"I Only Have One Lifetime" - Dick Pike/"Kansas City" b/w "I'll Keep You Happy" - Hank Ballard & The Midnighters/"Sugaree" b/w "Rain Down Tears" - Hank Ballard And The Midnighters/"Don't Let Your Sweet Love Die" b/w "I'm Grateful" - Trini Lopez... Thanks - John [ -- I'm not sure I understand the question completely, but yes, they all had different mono (regular 45) releases. The master numbers, sometimes the labels, and most of the time the record numbers for the stereo issues were at least slightly different from the regular mono issues. The stereo singles are pretty rare these days, but because of low demand, the prices are generally reasonable, IF you can find them. On the other hand, the first few titles you mention (up to and including the Wildcats 45) are all rechanneled on "stereo" 45s, so why bother? The others, all on King and Federal, are true collectors' items which were in true stereo, and some of which have never appeared in that mode again. -- MC] |
|
Name: Mark
Mathews From: ny Time: 1998-01-18 19:25:49 Comments: I'm with everyone else on the Rhino/Atlantic thing. I now don't trust anything on those labels; there's mono all over the place. I've had to scour used bins and stores for old '80s Atlantic re-issues of Greatest Hits, etc. to get the stereo we've all been hearing for 30 years. Our local oldies station (B-103, Long Island) also goes out of their way to play the stereo versions of Atlantic & Motown material, so when are these guys gonna get the message? Enough with the Mono.... Anyway, there must be fellow Simon & Garfunkel fans in here. I haven't seen mention of their boxed set Old Friends. This is a must have... throw away those hideous sounding re-issues. They found the real master tapes (finally!) and you get to hear the first-generation tapes on CD. There's a full page producer's note from Bob Hyde on the sound and finding the original tapes. He writes "...as time went on, inferior, multi-generational copies replaced the originals as cutting/working masters." Well there's no comparison, when you A-B the new box set with the previous CDs. |
|
Name: John
Mahoney Time: 1998-01-18 21:01:25 Comments: Hi Mike, Brenda & all, I thought I'd pass this along. I found a pretty good "radio station" on the Internet that plays 24 hours a day over the Net without commercials, DJs or news. There are 3 major channels: Pop ('80s & '90s), Oldies ('50s, '60s & '70s) and Dance ('80s & '90s). While listening to the oldies channel, I noted many seldom heard gems & in stereo! They even have a frame to display the current song playing and the artist performing. I found it great opportunity to hear songs I've only seen by title but never heard, and I liked the have uninterrupted music without the use of say a 5 CD changer. The site is free and is: http://www.on-air.com/ Quality is absolutely not hi-fi, but that said, it's not bad either. However, be prepared to have the songs break up, cut out or echo skip like a mistracking CD player whenever there is too much net congestion or you're downloading some other site while using the station as background music. And depending on your modem, what version of RealPlayer you have and such, you may or may not be able to hear the stereo. As the station comes on line the first track (a station ID) is ALWAYS in mono. You can also check out what's recently aired by clicking on the "What's Playing Now?" button and then clicking on the channel of your choice. Here's a sample of songs played in about a 1/2-hour period: (Not all were in stereo) Tremeloes - "Silence Is Golden"/Impressions - "I'm So Proud"/Skyliners - "Pennies From Heaven"/Troggs - "Wild Thing"/Hollywood Flames - "Buzz-Buzz-Buzz"/Billy Vaughn & Orchestra - "UNTITLED" (Whoops! A limitation is revealed.)/Buddy Holly - "Not Fade Away"/Duane Eddy - "My Blue Heaven"/Mamas & Papas - "Monday Monday"/Hondells - "Little Honda" ... Also heard (in stereo & in no particular order): "Wade In The Water" - Ramsey Lewis Trio/"Runaway" - Del Shannon/"Patricia" - Perez Prado And His Orchestra/"Tragedy" - Fleetwoods/"Little Black Egg" - Nightcrawlers/"Make Me Your Baby" - Barbara Lewis/"Enter The Young" - Association/"Ride Captain Ride" - Blues Image/"The Diary" - Neil Sedaka/"Things I Should Have Said" - Grass Roots... Not in stereo but rare! "It's Late" (w/ false start and studio talk) - Ricky Nelson/"Melodie D'Amour" - Ames Brothers/"Fallin" - Connie Francis.... On the downside, a re-recording of "Stagger Lee" by Lloyd Price and very little, if any, from the '70s as advertised, unless I'm not properly accessing the site. Regards - John |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-18 22:47:36 Comments: Re: Simon and Garfunkel... First, FWIW, the producer is Bob Irwin. Anyway, I just happened to be listening to the set this very moment! I love it! One thing that struck me is that in addition to EQ, etc. placed on some of the copy masters, there was probably echo added as well. Listen to a song like "Mrs. Robinson." On previous issues (at least the ones I have), at the end of the song, when everything is in one channel, there is quite a bit of echo in the other channel. Pretty much no echo on the box version... My only complaint on the set were the crossfades - "Save the..." into "America" and at the start of "Song For The Asking" - "Bye, Bye Love" does not even proceed it on the box! I can't understand why they would use the LP crossfade instead of a "hard" intro... Oh well. |
|
Name: David R.
Modny Time: 1998-01-19 00:38:30 Comments: Re: S&G Old Friends box set. Although the first 3 albums were re-mixed entirely from the original multi's, Bookends and Bridge Over Troubled Water were remastered from the first generation two-track LP masters. Thus, the reason for the crossfades on "Song For The Asking" and "America". Hope this helps - Dave M. |
|
Name: Charles G. Hill Website: Chez Chaz From: Dustbury, Oklahoma Time: 1998-01-19 05:59:20 Comments: For Paul Stoddard: I was wandering through Time Warner's corporate Web site this past weekend, and on a hunch, I peeked under "Warner Music Group". Sure enough, Rhino is listed as one of the Atlantic labels. I leave it to the pundits to decide whether this qualifies as Bad News. [ -- For sure, Rhino is distributed by Warner, and for sure they seem to hold a lot of sway, but I was never under the impression that Warner owned Rhino. -- MC] |
|
Name: Walt Haake Time: 1998-01-19 20:09:30 Comments: Thanks to John Mahoney for sharing the Oldies On-Air site. A favorite of mine is 1548 AM Capital Oldies in London, offering live streaming. Check them out at www.capitalgold.co.uk/ Click on the box that says "Listen Live!," then, on the next screen, click on "Click Here to hear"... |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-20 13:29:08 Comments: Re: S&G crossfades. While they did use the 2 track masters, crossfades (from what I have understood) are usually seperate edits that are put in at master time. Case in point: the Beatles' "A Day in the Life" crossfaded on the Sgt. Pepper CD, but had a cold intro on the Beatles 1967-1970 CD. |
|
Name: David R.
Modny Time: 1998-01-20 17:47:51 Comments: Re: S&G crossfades: It is true that crossfading is ususally done when the banded album master is being made. This is the problem here, as Irwin and Anesisni used those said "album masters" as their two-track source. I'm sure they could have gone back to the unbanded original two-track mixes (as in Beatles 1967-1970's "A Day In The Life"), if they still exist. Take care - Dave M. |
|
Name: Mark
Mathews From: NY Time: 1998-01-20 20:35:22 Comments: RE: Crossfades. I'm sure it's always been a matter of choice, but at that time I think they were pretty much making the 2-track LP tape, then mastering it to vinyl. They can go back and fix it if they have all the original multi's intact, but we know how they can mysteriously vanish. Also to Luke: the previously issued 3CD box The Simon & Garfunkel Collection containing their first 5 LPs was an attempt to "improve" the sound a little, and had reverb added throughout. You can sometimes mask a poor quality tape by punching up the highs and adding a little reverb, but there's only so much you can do with a 5th generation tape. - MM |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-21 00:39:28 Comments: Re: S&G stuff... 1) Crossfades - as far as I know, one would not have to go back to the multitracks - the songs should be intact in 2 track form, w/o the crossfades. Also, Irwin has already stated that the multitrack tapes do indeed exist, so... 2) Reverb - I was comparing to the Collected Works set, so that may be the case... I just took a listen to my Greatest Hits tape, and the reverb does indeed seem to be gone... |
|
Name: Jerry Griffith From: Regina, Sask. CANADA Time: 1998-01-21 01:59:43 Comments: I hesitate to do this, but I can't resist... I've found a supply (about 9) of the 1993 2CD boxed set of Annette:: A Musical Reunion with America's Girl Next Door in a liquidation store of all places, for approx. $6.00 U.S. As a favour to oldies collectors, I would be willing to send this superb boxed set (Mike rates it an A) for the exact cost to me. If anyone is interested, please e-mail me at PgsI@aol.com |
|
Name: Marty
Natchez Time: 1998-01-21 14:56:14 Comments: Remember listening to stereo LPs through headphones? If so, I need a BSN expert to verify if the 1965 album "Baby Don't Go" by Sonny & Cher and Friends (Reprise RS-6177) contained the tracks "Love is Strange," "Do You Want to Dance" and "Let The Good Times Roll" by Caesar and Cleo in true stereo? Also, what was the stereo status of "Leavin' Town" (sung by Bill Medley) on that release? I bought a mono copy of the album, thinking that the stereo pressing was entirely rechanneled. What do you know? |
|
Name: tom
moulton From: new york city Time: 1998-01-21 23:06:19 Comments: I am wondering what happened to all those 1/2" tapes that were recorded on 3 & 4 track machines in the late '50s & all through the '60s, that a number of record companies and producers discarded because they had a great mono mix and saw no need to keep the multitrack??? I am finding out that people have saved some of these tapes by taking them out of the trash, or a friend or neighbour threw them out. Whatever the reason, a number of these tapes have survived and I have been lucky enough to find some of them. Do any of you have any tapes or know someone who does? I would certainly like to know. I am not trying to change history, I am trying to preserve some of these songs in another way than a beat up scratchy record as the only source. There are a number of oldies that will be coming out this year in true stereo for the first time, and it is for this reason that I want to turn over every stone and look in all the corners to find them. If you have any tapes, or information on who does, you can contact me at tommoulton@aol.com thank you [ -- I see that you finally have an e-mail address, Tom. Welcome to the (late) 20th century! -- MC] |
|
Name: Tom
Daly Website: Skyline From: Malden, MA Time: 1998-01-22 00:40:12 Comments: The following is the text of some correspondence I recently had with Rhino about their shoddy product and packaging: Subject: Enough, already! From: "Tom Daly" Date: 1/20/98 8:21 AM This is a copy of my original message: Hi there! Let me tell you a story: Once upon a time, there was a little upstart reissue label called Rhino that was distributed by Capitol/EMI. During that enjoyable period, a customer could always depend on that upstart label for the best source material available, specifically for hard-to-find stereo oldies. The Billboard series, both rock n'roll and r&b were sensational, to say the least. The "Have a Nice Day" series was also well done. Then, the deal with Capitol/EMI switched to WEA and everything began to run downhill. Stereo reissues of vintage material began to disappear, being replaced by bogus mono mixes. Dropouts and other anomalies began to become plentiful on the CDs. Collectors began to revere labels like Varese Vintage and Ace (UK) because they offered the stereo mixes, and ignoring Rhino's packages because they could no longer be trusted for stereo. Thus goes the gospel according to Tom Daly and his friends. Tom Daly This was Rhino's reply: Well, Tom Daly is sadly mistaken if he thinks that Rhino has put less than the best possible care into the sound products we release. The stereo-mono thing is like real old, guy. If we think the mono sounds better than the stereo, that's what we'll put out. But we've released thousands of stereo recordings, and you're going to have to be specific when you complain there. You are aware, aren't you, that in the 50s and 60s stereo was an afterthought, generally done without artist input, and that the stereo version of a hit single would often be a completely different take than the hit (in other words, you've got it backwards -- the stereo mixes are the bogus ones). If the music coming out of two channels is more important to you than the overall sound itself, then so be it, but Rhino likes mono AND stereo both -- it just depends on the song. I've heard not one complaint about our Beg Scream & Shout box set, and that's over 95% mono. But what dropouts? What "anomalies"? Your generalizations aren't helpful, but we would definitely appreciate it if you would be specific in your complaints. Yes, in the last few years we've become a much bigger business and we can no longer afford to appeal to a collector audience only, but we're still as good as it gets in terms of sound (and packaging, actually). Enough, already, yourself! Bennett, for Dr Rhino Customer Service Here is my rebuttal: There's a dropout in "Love is Blue" on R2 71938. There's another in "The Locomotion" on R2 70623. "Silent Night" and "White Christmas" on R2 70637 are the wrong versions. Both were recorded in 1947. "White Christmas" by The Drifters on R2 70636 has a tape snag at 2:22. "Build Me Up Buttercup" is mono on R2 70630, yet stereo on R2 70327. I could continue, but I am sure you get the picture. Recordings that were in stereo on Atlantic vinyl are mono on CD reissues (Young Rascals). You issued Jackie Wilson's "Lonely Teardrops" in stereo on a Dick Clark disc and a Billboard R&B disc, yet on the Jackie Wilson hits compilation, it's mono, and doncha know the only one of those three discs I bought is the Jackie Wilson disc. The reason I bought the disc in the first place is that two of my friends have the other discs, and logic told me that "It's on Rhino, so it must be the stereo mix." It wasn't. Then, "Let's Hang On!" was stereo on the 4 Seasons' LP, yet on R2 72998, it's mono - and that set wasn't cheap! On top of it all, you don't indicate whether anything is mono or stereo on the packaging, so it's not until the disc is purchased that a buyer finds out that it's not what he or she expected. It's like playing Russian Roulette with recordings. In my previous correspondence, I mentioned Varese Vintage. They list, track by track, what's stereo and what isn't. When Collectables reissues an album, it's a sure bet that they used the same master as the stereo LP, unless the stereo LP was rechannelled, then they use the mono master. Granted, many of Collectables' reissues are in fact vinyl transfers, but those are usually easy to spot. When you think about it, is it too much to ask to have the packages indicate whether a recording is in stereo or mono? How much does it cost to print "stereo" or "mono" on the outside of the jewel box liner? About thirty cents per thousand? I don't think it would be too much to ask that if you are going to release something in mono that has appeared in stereo previously, at least print it on the jewel box liner so that those who don't want a mono copy can avoid wasting their money. Thank you for your prompt reply. Tom Daly I just thought I'd share this with BSN readers. Thought it might be worth a chuckle! [ -- I think what's not worth a chuckle is the arrogance and ostrich-like tendencies that say "not a single complaint..." They obviously don't want to know, because they certainly don't read any reviews about their material. -- MC] |
|
Name: David R.
Modny Time: 1998-01-23 20:24:46 Comments: Re: Rhino - I have to laugh at Rhino's "the mono sounds better" logic. I can count on one hand, fidelity wise, examples of where the mono mix sounded better than its stereo counterpart. Sure, mono may have been the dominating format in the '60s - but most of us are no longer listening to our music through over-compressed, bandwith-limited AM radio. Nor do I care to hear mixes that were sonically optimised for this format. P.S.: Anyone wanting to hear some revelatory stereo - check out the new, first time ever, stereo re-mix of "Pet Sounds" on The Pet Sounds Sessions box set...FANTASTIC!! Another P.S.: One mono mix I've personally always preferred, is "The Letter" by the Box Tops...a rare exception! Dave M. |
|
Name: Michael Jay From: New York City Time: 1998-01-24 15:36:51 Comments: Having just gotten back from a business trip, I noticed someone posted a site http://www.on-air.com and so I checked it out. Great oldies, and lots of rare stereo, as the original poster noted! Thanks for the tip. Michael |
|
Name: Larry Davis From: Longview, Washington Time: 1998-01-25 00:51:04 Comments: Rhino used to be the reissue label, and I have several hundred of their CDs to attest to it. I thank them for all that they have made available, when no one else would or could. It seems success changed their perspective from that of the collector, to one of just grinding out product. My complaint is mostly about what they haven't released that they should have. When I heard that Rhino had acquired the Roulette label I was hoping for an exhaustive reissue of Jimmie Rodgers. They put out ONE CD with his biggest hits on Roulette, and a couple from Dot and A&M, but nothing more ever came out. Time-Life, Vanguard, Sony, and others have done lots of folk reissues since then, but Rhino has just sat on most of the recordings of one of the 1950s' finest folk artist. Other missed opportunities include leaving "Letter From My Darling" off the Best Of Little Willie John CD. It was the flip side of "Fever" and where I grew up in central Florida it got LOTS of airplay. It deserves to be reissued. On Dr. Demento Gooses Mother, Rhino put out "It's In The Book" by Johnny Standley, but only Part One. When this was a number one hit in 1952, you never heard only Part One played. It was always the entire song. Likewise, with the Kings' hit on Just Can't Get Enough: New Wave Hits Of The '80s, Vol. 4, Rhino puts only "Switching To Glide" and omits "This Beat Goes On". On the radio, I never heard one without the other. The final annoyance is that they used a re-recording of "Little Drummer Boy" by the Harry Simeone Chorale on Billboard's Greatest Christmas Hits 1955-Present, rather than licensing the original from 20th Fox. Say, does anyone know where (if anywhere) this original Christmas song is available on CD? |
|
Name: Joel
Goldenberg From: Montreal Time: 1998-01-25 16:21:08 Comments: Re: Rhino and mono: They say mono sounds better than stereo in many cases, but one of the advantages of stereo is that it is flexible and can be remixed. As noted several times in Oldies On CD, many ADD discs sound marvelous. As well, from what I've heard, wonderful things have been done with the 78 RPM-era Frank Sinatra recordings in terms of noise reduction. A colleague who reveres Sinatra has testified as to his amazement with the sound quality of the RCA Dorsey recordings (early 1940s) and the Columbia material (early 1940s to early 1950s). So Rhino doesn't seem to have much of an excuse to withhold stereo versions. The mono should be presented as bonus tracks, as some at this website have said. |
|
Name: Mike
Arcidiacono From: Stereoland! Time: 1998-01-25 22:59:07 Comments: I read a blurb in ICE magazine a while back that said that the Kinks catalouge was going to be redone, and specifically, the first 5 LPs or so. Does anybody know anything about this? I'm virtually positve the Kinks early material was done on 4 track, as it was from late 1964/1965. This would mean that a nice stereo mix is certainly possible. If we can find out who is putting them out, maybe we can petition them to remix these to stereo for the new LP versions. Wouldn't it be GREAT to hear "Tired Of Waiting For You" is stereo for a change? -- Mikey |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-26 01:37:06 Comments: Re: Kinks... They were produced by Shel Talmy, the same guy who produced the My Generation LP by the Who... In the Who's case, Talmy has been involved in legal battles for years with the group over the tapes, thus nothing has been remixed. I'd be curious if Talmy allowed them to use the tapes for the Kinks issues. |
|
Name: Tom
Daly Website: Skyline From: Malden, MA Time: 1998-01-26 07:40:39 Comments: RE: Larry Davis' post about the Harry Simeone Chorale's "The Little Drummer Boy" on Rhino... The original single version is available on Casablanca 822 744-2, which is a complete reissue of the 1958 LP, Sing We Now of Christmas, from the stereo LP master. This, of course, means that the hit single appears once again, rechannelled (it was recorded and initially released in 1957 in mono only; no stereo master is known to exist). Ironically, Collectables also included the 1962 Kapp remake on The Ultimate Christmas Album. Perhaps it's too much bother to license the original version, and the labels figure the two versions are close enough to each other that we'd all be fooled. |
|
Name: Bruce Pempek From: Chicago Time: 1998-01-26 08:04:03 Comments: This is a WONDERFUL place! I've been just lurking and reading the posts for a coupla weeks and I must say you cover a wide range of topics! I have a question about the Vogues: The Co&Ce Sessions on Varese & The Vogues' Greatest Hits on Rhino have the "unadulterated" versions of their songs, however there was a Greatest Hits done by Reprise that had overdubs of horns & strings by Ernie Freeman that I haven't seen any of. I personally liked the addition of the overdubs on "Magic Town." It seemed to add more depth & emotion, particularly in the middle-8. Does anyone know if that version has made it onto CD anywhere? The only one I am aware of that has is "Five O'Clock World" from that release. One other question.... on the "Mono" thing. I remember hearing a beautifully imaged stereo version of the Crystals "Uptown", but can only find the Back To Mono & The Best Of The Crystals versions. I also have a few versions on Charly, etc, but can't seem to find that particular one. Anyone have any leads? Thanks! Bruce Pempek |
|
Name: Paul
Bigelow From: Austin,TX Time: 1998-01-26 10:43:54 Comments: Bruce, re: The Vogues with the overdubs. I have not heard the CD but there is a Japanese Vogues release that is part of the Warner Bros. Original Masters Series. I have hopes that the CD has the overdubs but cannot definitively say yea or nay. I think "Five O'Clock World" was released with overdubs on an early Warner CD compilation Hits of the 60's (or something like that that). |
|
Name: Marty Blaise Time: 1998-01-26 11:23:07 Comments: I'd like to pass along the following URL: http://www.adaptec.com/products/overview/cdrec.html It is the site for CD-Recordable Software & Technology. I don't know how expensive it is, but they say you can save your LPs to CD. Maybe some readers know more about this. [ -- The cost is moderate. Now you can get CD-R units in the $300 range. You need large hard drives and good PC hardware, and more than average technical problem solving skills, since the machines tend to be finnicky. The discs themselves have plummeted in cost from about $10 per disc a year ago to $3-5 or so today (and if you look around just a little, often less than that). You will end up wasting discs, also. ANY glitch in recording results in a frisbee. -- MC] |
|
Name: mike
arcidiacono From: nyc Time: 1998-01-26 12:44:21 Comments: Re- The Vogues. I'm not sure about the Japanese Warner Bros. releases, but my sense is that the Greatest Hits CD IS the doctored version with the strings. Also, the early Warner CD More Party Favorites, has "5 O'clock World" in straight mono without the strings. I think this was the CD that was referred to in a previous message. Mikey |
|
Name: Randy Price From: New York Time: 1998-01-26 23:58:42 Comments: Just received the new issue of ICE. Some guy wrote in to the Watchdog column complaining that one track on the new Four Tops Ultimate Collection CD ("Still Water (Love)") was in stereo instead of being the original single version. The response from Motown was that the single had been released some five months after the (stereo-only) LP on which it had appeared, and the mono version had been created by simply combining the two tracks of the LP version. Well, score one point for small favors in that Motown actually reissued a hit in stereo, but I fear we're fighting an uphill battle when consumers, having swallowed the company line, start complaining about a stereo reissue not being the original, even when it's exactly the same mix as the mono release. In a note to ICE on another subject, I added a P.S. asking them to please slap the guy who sent in that complaint. |
|
Name: Charles G. Hill Website: Chez Chaz From: Dustbury, Oklahoma Time: 1998-01-27 00:58:03 Comments: I dug out my copy of Warner Special Products' More Party Classics [9-27610-2, 1987], and it's got "Five O'Clock World" with the added strings. This isn't exactly the same compilation title as mentioned before, so I assume we're dealing with two different discs here. On the Kinks front, Rhino's Greatest Hits disc [R2 70086] is quite clearly marked "Mono Recordings", although the fine print reveals that one track - "Stop Your Sobbing" - is in fact in stereo. If nothing else, this demonstrates that Rhino, at one time or another, did have some idea of how to label discs mono or stereo, before somebody came up with the "Original Single Version" tag. |
|
Name: John
Adkins From: Phoenix Time: 1998-01-27 09:30:38 Comments: Re: Randy Price's posting on the Four Tops CD -- is it correct then, that save for the one track, the entire CD is in dreaded mono? Oops, sorry Motown, Rhino, Atlantic, et al. I misspoke. I meant to say "original single masters." I don't want to get sued by some record company for defamation of mono. |
|
Name: tom
moulton From: new york city Time: 1998-01-27 10:23:34 Comments: In reference to the Kinks: Castle Communications are going to reissue the complete Kinks catalog in the original MONO for a change??? instead of the electronically reprocessed versions we have been getting, starting with their second LP. I have been working on the Status Quo,(aka) Spectres & Traffic Jam tapes with the hopes of eventually getting to work on some of the Kinks. As I was told by Mick Carpenter of Castle, there may be something down the road of a rarities package containing the early Kinks tracks in stereo. This, of course, would be after all the other mono reissues have been released. |
|
Name: Dave
Sampson From: Ottawa, Canada Time: 1998-01-27 13:53:48 Comments: Re: Tom Moulton & Kinks info: I have a couple of the original Castle or PRT Kinks CDs remastered between 1987 and 1989. The Kinks [CLACD 155] is entirely STEREO with the exception of "You Really Got Me". On the other, Face To Face [PRT 8.26673], there are a couple of cuts that are mono (including "Sunny Afternoon" of course), but most of the tracks are stereo - albeit somewhat narrow on this disc. Hearing that the new Kinks discs will be mono I wish now I'd picked up all the early castle Kinks CDs when I had the chance. On the subject of Rhino, I used to buy pretty much every CD they put out, but thanks to their mono attitude in recent years I haven't bought a Rhino CD in well over a year. The last Rhino Disc I considered buying was the Ray Stevens Best Of, but hearing it's almost all mono they aren't getting my money. When are companies going to learn we no longer live in a transistor AM radio world and start giving us decent stereo sound when its possible to do so? |
|
Name: Marty
Natchez Time: 1998-01-27 20:58:23 Comments: I've just encountered a recent discovery that makes me shout "Hooray!" for Rhino reissuing a mono mix. The song is "Groovin'" by the Rascals, which, in mono, contains different harmonica passages than the stereo mix. That's right! The stereo mix is NOT the hit version, or have we stereophiles been too narrow of mind to check it out. Well, thanks to Rhino's The Rascals: Anthology 1965-1972 set, I'm glad to have the song in mono. The stereo mix is an impostor! I feel foolish that this revelation took more than 30 years to learn, thanks to another BSN contributor. But if you'll just open your mind as far as your ears, fellow members of the stereo community, you, too, might be surprised to hear what you've been missing. |
|
Name: Dan Asvitt From: Pleasant Hill, Ca Time: 1998-01-28 01:14:23 Comments: Bruce and Paul: the Japanese issue of The Best of the Vogues does, indeed, contain the stereo string overdubbed versions of "You're the One", "Five O'Clock World" and "Magic Town" you are seeking. It's on the Reprise label [WPCR-1387], and is well worth seeking out if you want it. |
|
Name: Tony
Waitekus Website: WHTS All Hit 98-9 From: Davenport, Iowa Time: 1998-01-28 09:45:08 Comments: Regarding Rhino: todays "net news" on www.allaccess.com suggests that Warners may buy out the other 50 per cent of Rhino. |
|
Name: Paul
Bigelow From: Austin, TX Time: 1998-01-28 09:57:03 Comments: I'm not trying to speak for every one who contributes to this group but I would believe that most stereo fans would support inclusion of UNIQUE mono mixes to any carefully researched package. However (and this has been been done) new stereo mixes of single versions can sometimes be created providing, perhaps, the best of both worlds. I think what irks most participants here is the exclusion of stereo in order to make some sort of self-righteous "statement". Strong cases can be made for both mono and stereo - just give us both! The same joy being felt by the community for the mono "Groovin'" would be just a strong for a stereo "Then He Kissed Me". |
|
Name: Paul
Stoddard From: Boston, MA Time: 1998-01-28 12:06:15 Comments: The idea of adding a mono mix as a bonus track is a great one and had been used by the reissue labels until the mono freaks managed to force their agenda on everyone. But stereo is the way to go for reissues. I have to laugh at Rhino and Motown. They put out newly-remastered Greatest Hits, Very Best Of, and Anthology packages on the same artist. You would think that, with 3 separate packages containing large amounts of overlap, at least one of the 3 would be in stereo. Not so. The consumer has his choice: mono, mono, or mono. Well, neither Rhino nor Motown has seen much of my money lately. On another topic: the great 3-CD Hollies anniversary set from EMI has been turning up in the cutout bins lately. This is a wonderful package with some really fresh-sounding stereo remixes. Of course, the mono freaks beat up severely on this package and its producer, Ron Furmanek. It's too bad that they spent so much time mouthing off and didn't spend more time listening. If you've been thinking about picking up this package, now may be the time to do it. |
|
Name: Bruce Pempek From: Chicago, Illinois Time: 1998-01-28 12:54:53 Comments: Ya gotta love this place!! Thanks to all who gave me leads on The Vogues "overdubbed" selections. I now have at least the name & catalog number to try and find! Has anyone figured out anything on the Crystals "Uptown" that I mentioned in stereo? Again, thanks to all!! Bruce Pempek |
|
Name: Paul
Bigelow From: Austin,TX Time: 1998-01-28 13:23:14 Comments: Another Hear, Here for the EMI Hollies set. I was very disappointed when EMI advertised the set and then delayed it for a year - thought it might never come out. It's great. REAL GOOD stereo balance on these recordings. It's too bad EMI did not follow up with more titles in British Invasion series. I know one was in the works for Peter and Gordon but it never showed up. I just can't help but feel that the "bean-counters" have gotten involved in this mono-stereo debate and have just decided that "original, glorious, mono" is cheaper to produce - less studio time. [ -- It's not really the bean-counters that are involved in the mono-stereo debate. Bean counters don't know anything about it and couldn't care less. It's the reissue producers that have suddenly become mono-zealots (...gone over to the dark side?) that control that. On the other hand, it is probably the bean counters that have made the difference in, say, the Peter & Gordon CD not being released due to number of tracks on the CD, slow sales of other titles in the series, etc. To them, it's just another CD. The studio time has already been put in, it's a "sunk cost," so if anything, it would cost less to put out than starting from scratch with just using mono tapes. -- MC] |
|
Name: David R.
Modny Time: 1998-01-28 19:44:05 Comments: Re: Crystals - I'm not sure about the CD availability of the Crystals' stuff in stereo - but I do know that the Ronettes' hits in stereo have been released on some import CDs of dubious legality, the best being The Ultimate Collection on the Marginal label. Although lifted from vinyl sources, the quality is pretty decent. Maybe this label did a Crystals release too ???. Dave M. [ -- I'm unaware of any Crystals records released anywhere in stereo except the one alternate take on the old Warner-Spector 2-LP set. All other Crystals songs I've heard in "stereo" have either been rechanneled or re-makes. There are a LOT of Crystals remakes floating around out there. -- MC] |
|
Name: David R.
Modny Time: 1998-01-28 20:01:52 Comments: Another thumbs up (way up!) for the Hollies' 30th Anniversary EMI collection. I too, remember the flak this set took when it came out. People crying that the hits "no longer sounded like they remembered". Never mind that those same hits could be found in mono or primitive two-track mixes on a dozen other collections. People still complained!!. Finally though, we stereo fans had new beautiful re-mixes with the vocals centered, and in great quality. Well, we ultimately know who EMI sided with - the new Hollies' Abbey Road disc is .... glorious mono :( |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-29 12:10:33 Comments: Re: Kinks - Is the official word that these will be in mono? I guess my impression was the opposite - ICE likened them to the Byrds reissues. I would hope that everything previously released in stereo would still be in stereo, and stuff not released in stereo yet would be remixed (I'm sure Shel Talmy still has the multitracks). Any insights? [ -- Tom Moulton's post here a couple of days ago is about as good an insight as you're going to get, since he's currently working with the people who are going to put the Kinks CDs out. -- MC] |
|
Name: Joel Goldenberg From: Montreal Time: 1998-01-29 14:25:29 Comments: Now that Rhino has been deservedly bashed for its mono policy, how about some kudos for Capitol and the Beach Boys for the Pet Sounds remix into stereo? It's glorious and deserves an A-plus. Maybe Rhino should return to Capitol distribution. Speaking of Pet Sounds, the box set liner note writers say the stereo mix is not better, just different. Don't believe it. It's 1,000 times better, liking cleaning a window that had 30 years of encrusted mold. [ -- Given the current climate, where people who love mono are very loudly voicing their opinions, Capitol probably felt that they had to say that or get bashed by the monomaniacs. It would be nice if all the "stereo folks" sent thank you notes to Capitol for a job well done. This can be done by dropping your e-mail note to: robin@hollywoodandvine.com -- MC] |
|
Name: Bob Fink From: Conn Time: 1998-01-29 15:50:13 Comments: Hi to all! Regarding stereo Crystals tracks: A label of dubious origin, "Spectacular Sound" from Europe, released a compilation disc a few years back on the Crystals which I seem to remember having some stereo content. I'll dig it out soon and post my findings ASAP! BOB |
|
Name: Tom
Daly Website: Skyline From: Malden, MA Time: 1998-01-29 18:02:23 Comments: Perhaps if we stereophiles banded together and only spent our dough on discs mastered by Walter DeVenne, Tom Moulton, Bob Irwin, Dennis Drake and Ron Furmanek, we could force the issue to get product issued in stereo. Also if enough of us complained to the labels that they need to contract with these mastering engineers for quality product, we might get some product we can appreciate. The following facts about the following labels irritate the hell out of me: RCA hasn't done anything decent in the way of reissues since the Nipper's Greatest Hits series other than Elvis. WEA, at least one-third of the recording industry, remasters little from session tapes - any old LP master will do for WEA (that includes Rhino, WB, Reprise, Atlantic, Atco, Elektra, Asylum, and Sire. EMI released a ton of discs remastered from session tapes in The Capitol Collector's Series, The Legends of Rock 'n Roll Series, and The Legendary Masters Series, then deleted every damned one of them. What's left? Sony. They do it right on Legacy. The only disc I am waiting for them to fix is Sly & the Family Stone's Greatest Hits. Everything else they've issued to date has little hiss, clean sound, no dropouts, and most of the titles issued are still available. How's that for a track record? [ -- I agree with most of what you say, but I've been pleased with what Elektra has done many times... They don't seem to be following the usual WEA philosophy. -- MC] |
|
Name: Luke
Pacholski Website: LukPac.org From: Madison, WI Time: 1998-01-29 18:34:27 Comments: Re: Sony - I would have to agree about Legacy. I have the first 4 Byrds CDs and the S&G box, and all of it is great - Bob Irwin (and Vic Anesini!) really works the magic on this stuff... The Who stuff has been pretty good (IMO), but none of that was through a specific record company - more through the band itself. I would have to say some of the Polygram Chronicles sets are pretty good, although in the case of Cream the master tapes are apparently gone, which is a damn shame. Anyone know exactly when the fire at Atlantic "happened," and if there are any articles on the net about it? |
|
Name: Charles G. Hill Website: Chez Chaz From: Dustbury, Oklahoma Time: 1998-01-29 19:29:17 Comments: With regard to Pet Sounds, monomania has always prevailed. During the days when Brother Records was distributed by Reprise, the vinyl reissue (MS 2197) contained the following putative High Truth: "This recording is pressed in monophonic sound, the way Brian cut it." And not just on the liner, either - it actually says that on the label. Of course, the S prefix in that Warner numbering system had historically been used to indicate a stereo release, but that's another matter. And NPR's All Things Considered spent about six minutes considering the new box set this past week. The stereo mix of "God Only Knows", a sample of which got on the air, is just about enough to justify the purchase all by itself. |
|
Name: Dave
Mack Website: Welcome To Dave Mack's Home Page From: Salem (The Witch City) Mass Time: 1998-01-29 22:56:32 Comments: Several months ago I made mention to Tom Daly at Skyline that I finally figured out something. The "NO" in the the name RHINO must mean "NO STEREO". Like so many others I too used to buy their products. They were, I repeat WERE a great source of stereo hard-to-find oldies. ("I'm A Fool" by Dino, Desi & Billy is one that comes to mind along with "Nothing Can Change The Shape Of Things To Come" by Max Frost & the Troopers. That was absolutely KILLER stereo!) It seems that the any old source will do mentality is prevalent. Why? Do they think that only audiophiles are looking for the STEREO versions? Recently a friend asked me to make a tape and he asked for the Norma Tanega. He was blown away to hear it in stereo! He then asked my why so much turns up in mono and why radio stations play MONO versions when the stereo version exists. As an oldies broadcaster I had to tell him the truth: Too many people (in management) just don't care. My question fellow audiophiles: What can we do? [ -- The playing of mono on stereo stations goes way back. The people running the station I worked at in the 1970s were deathly afraid that out-of-phase stereo would cancel part or all of the record on mono radios. I've actually heard this phenomenon... it's like 2 minutes of near-silence on a mono radio. Of course, it doesn't take a lot of work to figure out whether the tape you have is out of phase, and if so, to fix it, but as these Program Directors' philosophy went, "Why bother? Let's just play the mono." The idea of a megawatt FM stereo station playing mono for that reason alone kinda escapes me. Back to AM. -- MC] |
|
Name: Paul
Bigelow From: Austin, TX Time: 1998-01-30 09:42:04 Comments: Shel Talmy always seems to be involved in some sort of wrangling over master tapes. However, this may not be always the case. Repertoire in Germany released some very interesting Easybeats CDs with alternate/(new?) mixes of some of their more popular songs. The mixes claimed to be fom the Shel Talmy tapes. |
|
Name: Boppin'
Brian From: the 1st town mentioned in song by the Beach Boys Time: 1998-01-30 18:52:13 Comments: Is it just me, or are there others who can't help but read alla this stuff every time?!?! One suggestion to cut the eyestrain a bit - dump the white print on electric blue format! (Just thought I'd get a gripe in right off the bat! [ -- Hmmmm. Maybe I should delete the rest of your letter? :-) -- MC] Boy, I really had no clue that I was not the only one so freaked out about hearing STEREO stuff!.... Web surfers should check out www.on-air.com "oldies" as recommended by the folks on this message board - quite a lot of goodies pop up.... I also appreciate tips from astute stereo collectors found here.... One message said CDs from Disky (Holland) are a good bet (or perhaps - a POOR gamble!). Like many of these "imports", the Disky discs I own have been very "hit-or-miss." Compilation series like Hot Dogs, Hits & Happy Days and R&B Legends have a few re-recordings, and scruffy sound here & there.... Also a must to avoid: 20 Greatest Hits 1959 & ..1961 & ..1966 on Deluxe, For Lovers Only on Pilz, and numerous Charly "budget" jobs in 1000 series (many - not all - are re-recordings).[ -- Actually, the DeLuxe re-recordings have always been a favorite of mine. I love pulling them out and playing them for folks who are not very aware that such things exist. These particular things are so frightfully bad that even if you're not a collector, you've just got to laugh. The Coasters sounding like Homer & Jethro? "Sea Cruise" starting with the sound of an ocean liner? Priceless. And to think that somebody was actually serious when they made that recording. -- MC] Interestingly enough, the Highland trademark found only upon opening the Deluxe discs is responsible for decent reissues of King/Federal/etc. '40s & '50s goodies, but beware of some of the ones that turn out to have a paltry 8 cuts each (some in 1400 series)! Anyone out there have any info./warnings/stereo "tips" on other "odd-ball" labels, please take a minute to type 'em up here. Anyone have any ideas about the '50s-'60s-'70s reissues from labels like F B (may be same as Fat Boy ??) 100, 200 & 4000 series; Instant (5000 series); Tri; Telesonic ("Magic Collection" series); GRF ("Cruisn'", "Sixties Decade", etc.); Thunderbolt (mostly '60s r&r); Newsound (100s, 700s).... Other labels I've had good luck with (but don't know enough about & have had a hard time contacting.. = out of biz?) are Castle, Sequel & Magnum (Force)/Blue Moon/Sundown. The Hickory stuff from Rusty & Doug Kershaw is in stereo on their Sundown CD. A couple final "buyer bewares:" Dominion (Ktel subsid.) is almost all re-recordings, the Chess (U.K.? Ger.? ..made in "E.E.C.") 1000s are hit or miss - some are fine, some sound as if they are dubbed from LP (replicating graphics/track line-ups of U.S. MCA/Chess issues). Yes, I realize a good portion of this type of stuff has no other source except old records, but does it have to be a poorly mastered 20 year old "fake" stereo LP!?O.K., next subject.... Surf Report! (Don't know if these may have been reviewed extensively here - or elsewhere, but here goes anyway...) The great Rhino (What?!?!) Cowabunga! 4 CD surf box set has quite a bit of stereo that I had never heard before, and stereo where most other reissues have done mono. Since most folks here would be interested in the '60s stuff only, & details on tracks/artists are redily available elsewhere & y'all sure know where, suffice it to say of the 3 '60s discs, 25 tracks are stereo. A few of the surprises: "Latin'ia", "Shoot That Curl" (Chris & Kathy -- actually binaural), "Body Surf" by Aki Aleong (Hey, who controls alla the Vee Jay stuff now & when will it be remastered?!)... "Hard-to-find" stereo stuff is also on the following other spotless sounding surf-y selections: More Surf Legends & Rumors - Garland(DCC) Steve Hoffman's up to his old sonic sorcery - bag-o-tricks this time around includes a "hidden" track: "Cinnomon Cinder" by the Pastel 6. Lively Ones - Hang 5! Best of... [Del-Fi 9004 has 18 of 24 stereo. Collectables has a 3-CD (!) Sunrays set, with super sound. Meanwhile, back on dry land, look for the cut-out Chess/MCA Clarence 'Frogman' Henry (4 stereo), Dale Hawkins, & others. Back to Steve Hoffman - DCC's Music for a Bachelor Den in Hi-fi [#079] has "Moonglow/Picnic" & "Around the World (In 80 Days)" in stereo. Stereophiles' heroes Bob Irwin & Al Quaglieri did 5th Dimension 2CD, plus Bob I. did Lee Dorsey Arista Definitive CD - mostly stereo + "20 Bit" mastering, whatever that is.... Also, it was Irwin, not Hyde doing the S&G 3CD.... Regarding the death of Capitol & EMI series, a few have trickled out while no one is looking, I guess, albeit in a trimmed to the bone (no notes) format - Patty Duke [EMI 29787] has all but TV themes in stereo, plus I remember one, maybe 2 Ferrante & Teicher collections that I passed on. Does anyone know what's the deal on: Sequel has tantalizing looking recent items like Memories are Still Made of Hits (Lots of coulda-shoulda beens... mono where stereo elsewhere!)... ACE(!) crossfades 2 cuts ("I've Told Every Little Star" & "Triangle".... Cute on-air, I suppose..?!?!) on the Early Girls" vol. 1, and the STEREO "effect" (?!) on some cuts on their Vernon Green & the Medallions Dootone CD... not wide, mind you... this was the early '50s!! Almost has the same sounding stereo "image"/"feel" as some of the '40s Turner/MGM/Rhino soundtracks coming out recently - but our man Vern recorded in a So. Central garage, not a Culver City soundstage!! Rhino has a 2CD Ben E. King Anthology that I've read 2 reviews of - 1 sez "all stereo", 1 "all Mono"!! Which is it ?! (If I recall correctly the Reuss guide & "Roots & Rhythm" were the 2, usually 100% reliable, reviews/rundowns). How about "Stand By Me", "Young Boy Blues", "Spanish Harlem" & "1st Taste of Love" for a "Super session?!".... Only last of 4 I haven't got stereo. And what about "Lonely Winds" (Drifters)??? Check early efforts from Atlantic like 3-CD Ray Charles, 2 2-CD Drifters sets (Kim Cooke), they were gettin' it right for a while there, pre-Rhino/MONOmania. OK, wrap time - before I get "carpal-tunnel"! Fans should check in with their "votes" at Norton where Etiquette reissues are being planned. Wailers, Sonics (starting in mid-'60s) were all recorded in stereo, and they're considering mono vs. stereo (of course, stereo sounds incredible - this stuff really packs a whallop!). EMAIL Miriam or Billy at nortonrec@aol.com & check out their website. [ -- Brian, Brian, Brian. You've been out in the cold all by yourself way too long. Almost every CD you mention has been reviewed, and most of your questions answered, in the back issues of Both Sides Now Stereo Newsletter, where there have been letters like those on the chat board for the last 11 years! Where have you been? -- MC] |
|
Name: G
Cassan From: Mississauga, Ontario Canada Time: 1998-01-30 19:46:24 Comments: Can anyone please advise as to the stereo content on the two Curb CDs by the 4 Seasons, entitled Gold Vault of Hits and Second Gold Vault of Hits? [ -- Well, as I always say, if you subscribed to the Both Sides Now newsletter, you'd have had that information months ago. :-) Nevertheless, the reviews below are provided to you at no charge. -- MC] FOUR SEASONS - GOLD VAULT OF HITS (Curb D2-77891) [AAD] 1997 [Rating = C] Time = 35:03. Oppressively hissy, but I love the album, and at least they've left the track order the same as the original LP, unlike the 2nd volume (see below). Reissue of the 1965 LP of the same name [Philips PHS 600-198], with the stereo version of "Rag Doll" substituted for the rechanneled version that was on the original vinyl. Excellent sound, if you can ignore the hiss. Let's Hang On (M)/Rag Doll (S)/Ronnie (M)/Big Man In Town (S)/Silence Is Golden (S)/Bye Bye Baby (Baby Goodbye) (S)/Dawn (Go Away) (M)/Save It For Me (S)/Girl Come Running (M)/Betrayed (S)/Toy Soldier (S)/Cry Myself To Sleep (S)FOUR SEASONS - 2ND GOLD VAULT OF HITS (Curb D2-77892) [AAD] 1997 [Rating = C] Time = 31:43. Another hissy almost-reissue, this time of the 1966 LP of the same name [Philips PHS 600-221]. Here, they've jumbled the playing order into an almost random-play mode, substituted a mono version of "Walk Like A Man" for the original vinyl's stereo, and introduced a high-pitched whistle on "Working My Way Back To You." A shame; I've always like the original LP and it's playing order, etc. I've Got You Under My Skin (S)/Connie-O (S)/Big Girls Don't Cry (S)/Stay (S)/Peanuts (S)/Alone (S)/Opus 17 (Don't You Worry ‘Bout Me) (S)/Candy Girl (S)/Walk Like A Man (M)/Working My Way Back To You (S, high-pitched tone on one channel, not on original vinyl)/Marlena (S)/Sherry (S) |
|
Name: Tom
Daly Website: Skyline Record Productions Time: 1998-01-31 01:12:31 Comments: For those who care, I've remixed "Footstompin' (Part 1)" by the Flares so that the footstomps heard through the verses on the mono mix are now in the two-track stereo mix. How could anyone have issued that in two-track stereo without the correct sound effects of the song's namesake? [ -- A rhetorical question, I assume. -- MC] |
|
Name: Christopher
Nagel From: Michigan City, IN Time: 1998-01-31 15:52:15 Comments: Just a quick comment on the RhiNO Stereo/Mono controversy: It's too bad the people doing the Rhino/Turner Classic Movies CDs couldn't be put in charge of the oldies re-issues. These folks are doing a excellent job re-mixing into Stereo a lot of the old MGM musicals and scores, going all the way back to the late '30s! (The Wizard of Oz Main Title Theme is just such an example). They have even taking the time to mark on the CD back cover as to which cuts are in stereo, something I haven't seen on a Rhino oldie release in a long time. Also, Mike, the Stereo Chat is the best part of your site. The blue with white print looks OK to me!!! [ -- Not every Turner/Rhino movie CD is a winner. The Gone With The Wind 2-CD set is all rechanneled, and pretty noisy at that. -- MC] |
|
Name: Bob Fink From: Conn. Time: 1998-01-31 18:46:05 Comments: Hi. Re My last post: After checking out the Crystals CD on "Spectacular Sound", there is indeed no stereo content. I confused it with a Ronettes title on the same label! Sorry to get you all excited. For any Darlene Love fans in cyberland, there was a great live vinyl release in the mid/late 80's on Rhino that's worth hunting down. I'll dig it out and post catalog #, etc. It's in stereo to boot! Thanks. Bob. |
Return to Stereo Chat Board Archives Main Page
Return to Both Sides Now Home Page